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Some Alabama cities and counties using the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers to haul off tornado debris say they have no idea how much the service is costing — a problem that has become more pressing as local governments pick up more of the tab for the cleanup.

The mystery of the rates led members of the Cullman County Commission on Tuesday to announce they are terminating the Corps’ work in their jurisdiction as of July 29. Going forward, Cullman County residents must get storm rubble to roadsides, and county crews will pick up the debris when they can, Cullman County Commission Chairman James D. Graves said.

That approach will take longer, but it’s better than proceeding without knowing what the Corps of Engineers is charging, he said.

“It’s an expensive endeavor, and we’re getting a little gun-shy here about what our cost is going to be,” Graves said.

Although some counties say they have received price information from the Corps, more of those interviewed in recent days by The Birmingham News said they had not.

In Cullman, county attorney Tim Culpepper said officials had asked repeatedly about the cost of the cleanup, but the Corps would not provide even an average or a range that would allow the county to estimate an ultimate price.

The Federal Emergency Management Agency had no quibble with Cullman County’s decision. “That’s strictly up to them,” said Frank Treadaway, FEMA’s task force leader for Cullman and several other counties. “It’s the county’s money … We’ve just got the Corps there as an option.”

The Corps of Engineers did not respond Tuesday to a question about Cullman County’s action, and it has repeatedly refused to provide specific information to The News about its rates for debris work.

In June, Corps spokesman Billy Birdwell said the rates can vary based on how far the debris must be hauled to a disposal site. On July 7, spokeswoman Nakeir Nobles said in an email: “Any costs associated with our cleanup efforts are between FEMA and the state and the local jurisdiction, not the Corps of Engineers.”

The uncertainty about the Corps’ rates was not a major issue for the first 30 days of the cleanup, when the federal government and state of Alabama paid the full price for debris removal. After that grace period, local governments became responsible for 5 percent of the cost, with the state picking up another 5 percent and FEMA paying 90 percent.

Starting today, FEMA’s part of the cost drops to 75 percent, and local governments and the state will split the remainder, paying 12.5 percent each.

Sonny Brasfield, the executive director of the Association of County Commissions of Alabama, said local officials’ concerns about the expense of the Corps have grown with their share of the cost. County officials have increasingly complained, he said, but “it’s very, very difficult to get the Corps to specify what they’re going to charge.”

Various options

From the beginning, counties and cities had the option of hiring private contractors to pick up storm debris. A few did, including Jefferson County, Birmingham and Fultondale. But more decided to use the Corps of Engineers, which offered several advantages.

For one, FEMA initially said it would pay 90 percent of the cleanup costs in jurisdictions that signed on with the Corps and only 75 percent for those with private contractors. But even after that difference was eliminated, going with the Corps meant local governments wouldn’t have to worry about tracking the cleanup, paying money upfront for the work, or meeting FEMA’s rules to get reimbursed.

Local officials said they weren’t given information upfront about what the Corps’ rates would be.

In Lawrence County, solid waste director Willie Allen said he learned from the Corps just Monday that the charge for removing debris from public roadsides there will be $42 per cubic yard. That’s in the range of what Tuscaloosa Probate Judge Hardy McCollum said he was eventually told by the Corps. And it is a common figure cited by officials in other jurisdictions who haven’t gotten answers from the Corps.

Sometimes, the rumored prices go much higher. Cullman Mayor Max Townson said last week he’d heard everything from $42 to $100 per cubic yard.

Even at $42 per cubic yard, the Corps’ rates for roadside pickup appear considerably higher than those being charged by private contractors working in areas such as Jefferson County. FEMA officials have said the difference dwindles when the cost of tracking the work of private contractors is added.

But for county and city officials who chose to rely on the Corps, that debate is now largely beside the point. Most say they believe they made the right decision, but they need to know what the impact will be on their bottom lines.

Madison County Commission Chairman Mike Gillespie said he will seek those answers today, for the first time. While he believes the Corps has done a good job, he said the cost questions must be resolved. “We just can’t go ahead blindly without knowing how much it’s going to cost us,” Gillespie said.

A number of local officials said they pressed hard to get the debris work done quickly when the cost share was better for cities and counties. But they also said cost was a secondary concern in the face of such devastating storms.

“Our main goal from the beginning was, ‘Let’s get the debris picked up as quickly as possible,’” said St. Clair County Commission Chairman Stan Batemon.

Even now, Batemon said, he is not concerned that he has not received a price from the Corps. Based on experts and people in the business, he said, he has an idea of what the debris removal will cost, and he has devised what he believes is a worst-case scenario for St. Clair.

“We have a plan in place where we could handle that without being surprised,” he said.

But at the Association of County Commissions, Brasfield worries the cost of the storms will be a tremendous drain on governments already facing revenue shortfalls and budget cuts. “That’s going to be the disaster after the disaster, when we start trying to pay for this,” he said.

Join the conversation by clicking to comment or email DeMonia at rdemonia@bhamnews.com.

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